Eviction

Ernie shared on NHF Dec 2014
www.airbnb.com/groups/content/content-99288


Eviction





On the 15th of December I was alerted to the fact that a woman named Angela had instant booked one of the three listings I offer in my San Francisco home. I sent the same booking confirmation message to her, via Airbnb messaging, that I send to all guests when a booking has been confirmed. Among other things included in this primary message we ask the guest to please read through the house rules and to confirm their acknowledgement and understanding. We also ask the guest to inform us, at least two days in advance, of their anticipated arrival time. We offer check-ins from 3-7pm but for a nominal fee of $25 we allow guests to make arrangements to drop-off luggage prior to check-in such that they can explore the city unencumbered before their actual check-in. Angela indicated that she would like to drop her luggage off at 11:30am. As this would trigger the $25 fee, I messaged her that we would be happy to accommodate her request and reminded her that the fee would apply. She did not respond to my request regarding her acknowledgement and understanding of the house rules. I immediately sent an altered reservation request reflecting the early luggage storage fee of $25. She never accepted the altered reservation request.



Fast forward to the 17th of December, less than 24 hours before her intended luggage drop off. I sent Angela a message reminding her to please read through the house rules and to confirm her acknowledgement and understanding. She replied, “Yeah I did read.” I then sent her a second message asking her to please accept the altered reservation request reflecting the early luggage drop-off fee. She replied, “I hope that 25 $ could be waived.” I replied, “The fee cannot be waived. If you do not want to drop off your bags, no problem. We will expect your arrival at 3pm, see you at 3pm.” She replied, “Can I pay you cash for that, I tried to accept the altered reservation, but I cannot get it to work.”



At this point, I was alerted to three red flags from this guest, 1) she had already indicated to me that she feels rules and policies don’t or shouldn’t apply to her when she ignored my initial request for her to read the house rules and and to confirm her acknowledgement and understanding of them, 2) she (rudely) tried to renegotiate the early luggage drop-off fee that had already been agreed to (this fee is highlighted in our house rules and become part of the contract once the listing has been instant booked) when she said that she hoped the fee could be waived and 3) she tried to transact business outside the Airbnb system when she offered to pay me cash rather than asking me to send another altered reservation or having customer service assist her in accepting the altered reservation that had already been sent to her (transacting business outside the Airbnb system is a violation of Airbnb’s terms and conditions).



I determined that this guest might be more of a problem than she was worth and decided to ask Airbnb customer service if they would be willing to cancel her one night booking without penalizing me for canceling myself. I explained to customer service that, because I have hosted over 500 booking in just over one year’s time, and because this guest has already indicated her lack of respect for my terms and conditions as well as Airbnb’s terms and conditions, my instincts told me that this guest would likely 1) run afoul of other terms and conditions in that she was unlikely to follow my house rules to the letter (our rules are not lengthy and are designed to ensure the comfort and enjoyment of all people on the property, guests and hosts alike) and 2) be dissatisfied with the services received by me no matter how good they were based upon her trying to undervalue them as evidenced by her stating she hoped the fee would be waived perhaps resulting in an unfavorable review from the guest. I said that a person’s past behavior is the best indicator of their future behavior and I was concerned she would be a potential problem not only for me but more importantly for my other guests who are in rooms on the same floor of the house as her room. Airbnb explained that I was free to cancel the booking if I was uncomfortable with the guest but that I would have to suffer the cancellation penalties as outlined by Airbnb policy. Airbnb would not cancel the booking on my behalf without penalty to me. They explained that past behavior was in no way a positive indicator of future behavior and that they believed Angela would be an exemplary guest. I explained that I was disappointed with their decision regarding this matter and that, as a superhost, I felt they should better trust my instincts and lend support when it is requested. They responded that they were sorry I felt unsupported but that there was nothing else they could do to assist me.



I messaged the guest that at this time we were no longer able to accommodate her early bag drop-off but that we were looking forward to meeting her when she arrived at 3pm the next day, December 18th.



The guest arrived, asked me to carry her luggage to her room up the three flights of stairs to the fourth floor, which I did, and I went through the usual check-in tour and procedures that I do routinely with all incoming guests.



Fast forward to 6:45am this morning, December 19th: I awoke to use the restroom and while in the restroom immediately below the laundry room (the laundry room is immediately adjacent to Angela’s bedroom and has a large black plastic adhesive PRIVATE sign with an image of a hand being held up like a stop sign on the outside of the door). I heard the gas dryer tumbling above me. After leaving the bathroom, I went upstairs to find the laundry room in use (we do not offer the laundry facilities to guests and indicate this in two ways 1) access to washer and dryer are not mentioned in the listing nor are they checked off as optional amenities in the amenity section of the Airbnb website and 2) the large black plastic adhesive PRIVATE sign with an image of a hand being held up like a stop sign not the outside of the door). I look inside the dryer and there are female jeans, a t-shirt and red panties tumbling in the dryer. The door to Angela’s room was open, the light was on and I could hear her moving about. I knocked on her door to which she quickly replied and I asked her if she had been using the dryer to which she replied that she had. I explained to her that the laundry facilities were not offered to the guests and asked her if she had seen the PRIVATE sign on the door. She said that she had but that she needed the dryer because she had left her clothes outside on the private deck off her room (the sliding glass door to which was wide open with rain pouring down on the hardwood floor and cold air breezing into the house triggering the furnace down the hall and stairs). She claimed to have left her clothes outside on one of the wooden chairs overnight and that they had become wet as a result of the downpour. She explained that every other Airbnb she has stayed in has offered laundry facilities. I asked her how many Airbnb’s had she used in an attempt to impress upon her that each was unique, offering different accommodations and amenities. Also, I asked, if she has used Airbnb so much, then why had she received no reviews (another red flag)? It was during this exchange that I reminded her that not only had she trespassed when she opened the “do no enter door” but that she had also violated our rule that states: “Please be courteous and respectful of both the other guests and residents by avoiding excess noise particularly between the hours of 10 PM and 8 AM.” She had been making excess noise by running the laundry facilities at 6:45am and had made other noises that had, apparently, disturbed the guest in the room adjacent to hers (he was now up and about and ended up returning to sleep, once she left, for two more hours). She also had food piled up on the desk in the room; oranges and some kind of crackers, a clear violation of the rule that states: “Absolutely NO FOOD is permitted in the bedrooms as this encourages the local ant population to move in. Please use the dining room to consume your snacks/meals should you decide to bring them in. We have a designated food storage area in the dining room for your convenience.”



She acknowledged the rules and acknowledged that she had violated them. I asked her why she felt these rules shouldn’t apply to her and her reply was that the rules are very strict and that I was strict due to my efforts of trying to enforce them. I had had enough. I keep a laminated card on the backside of the bedroom door to each bedroom that contains the house rules, house manual, among other information. She had been alerted to the presence of the card upon check-in just as all guests are routinely alerted. I peeled the card off, pointed to the rule about the food and asked her to read it to me. I then said to her she was a problem because she felt that she was above my rules and that I’d like her to pack her things and leave immediately. She got the message.



I then called Airbnb to inform them of her eviction. The customer service representative was very supportive and empathetic informing me that because there was already a case started with another agent, the one who had “assisted” me the on the 17th of December, that she would supplement that case file and that that agent would email and call me to discuss the case. That was at 7:00am this morning. Still no word from Airbnb. I am very disappointed mot only that Airbnb had failed to lend support when I had previously asked for it (I had pointed out that in 500+ booking I had never cancelled a single reservation, so that this clearly wasn’t my M.O.), but also that as it turned out I was right about this guests likely behavior in that she would likely run afoul of my rules once here as indicated by her attitude toward the rules prior to her arrival. Although I am glad my instincts are keen but very disappointed that Airbnb did not value my instincts or support my reasonable request to cancel the booking in advance of her stay without penalty.
10 comments•5 likes
Following
Like
KATE
Nic and Rach
rie
Louise
Robert and Stefania

Delete
Hide
Evelyn
Evelyna year ago
Josh - I'm so sorry you just went through this. You knew this guest was an entitled person and because of Airbnb not backing you up you ended up with this situation. Bad guest and bad Airbnb.

Reply Like 1 like Delete
Deborah
Deboraha year ago
Ernest -- given your concerns, and given what you experienced in this situation from guest and from Airbnb, I am wondering if Instant Book is a good idea for you. It seems to me that if you had not had Instant BOok, this situation might not have occurred, as you could have waited for the guest to accept the special offer which included the luggage drop off fee, as the only offer she would be getting if she wanted to drop luggage early -- and you could also have waited to accept her reservation until after she indicated she had read the house rules.

My guess is that Airbnb is going to be hesitant to cancel a guest's reservation unless there is some clear violation already occurring, such as guest indicating they want to bring more guests than are permitted, guest doing third party booking, guest bringing pet when pet not allowed, and so forth. I would expect that the mere suspicion that a guest will not follow rules or a guest stating that they hope they won't be held to certain of the house rules, would not be sufficient for Airbnb itself to cancel a reservation, but it certainly is sufficient for a host to not accept a reservation in the first place. The desire to pay in cash for the luggage drop off fee does sound like a possible violation of terms, but this is a bit unclear since the fee doesn't apply to accomodations per se, but to additional fees. Some hosts for instance will bill TOT taxes separately from the total, payable through PayPal, and Airbnb does not state that this is not allowed.

In general, I would expect that "the bar would be high" as the saying goes, for Airbnb to cancel a guests' reservation, as they do not want to make a mistake in doing so. So my suggestion would be to remove Instant Book and have more dialogue with potential guests before allowing them to book, in order to be able to assess their basic attitude towards you and your rules and your home.

Reply Like 1 reply•10 likes Delete
Andrew
Andrewa year ago
This is, word for word, exactly what I was thinking.

Danny
Dannya year ago
Quite frankly with the damage to the hardwood floors from the rain coming in the open doors and her snooty attitude, I would willing pay whatever penalty ABB would levee to get this woman GONE!
Reply Like 3 likes Delete
Nic and Rach
Nic and Racha year ago
It's unbelievable ! But I guess there is truly one bad apple in every Apple tree. As a retired lawyer, you could have prevented this from happening specially there were 3 red flags for this guests of which your instinct already telling you to decline. Anyway, the damage has been done and now you have to deal with it, whether to involve Airbnb for whatever damage that this guest caused you.. or just eat it and shrug your shoulder. I have the same situation with you regarding cancellation of guests and that I will be paying the cancellation fees, if I cancel.. I dont know why Airbnb lean more towards the guests rather than the hosts...So, from there on.. I just dont want to waste my time calling Airbnb, because I know that they will stick to their gun and would tell me that they are going going to accomodate my cancellation requests or just pay the the fee of $50.00.. for the first occurence and $100 bucks for the second occurence and so forth.. I'm sorry Ernie, I'm sure you are not happy with the whole situation but, think about this.. You are still standing in your 2 feet and still breathing.
Breath in -- Breath out and just be prepare for the next guests... Keep on smiling Ernie.. like the one in your picture profile.

Reply Like 1 like Delete
Nic and Rach
Nic and Racha year ago
correction: " they are not going to accommodate "

Reply Like 2 likes Delete
Tania & Andrew
Tania & Andrewa year ago
Please let us know when and if Airbnb finally replies!

Reply Like 3 likes Delete
Deb
Deba year ago
I can see both sides to this situation. Certainly the guest made errors in judgement, but they do feel like minor infractions. I can sympathize with her on the baggage fee. $25 feels like a significant fee for this courtesy that is often offered for free. Putting clothes in the dryer and snacking in her room are similar issues. Annoying, but are they really causes for eviction? I agree that the guest was not following the rules but my feeling is the punishment was too harsh for the crime. With all due respect, I actually sympathize with the guest here. Sorry Ernest, you are still one of my favorite contributors to this forum, but I respectfully disagree on this one.

Reply Like 4 replies•8 likes Delete
Ernie
Ernie a year ago
Guests have notice of my policies (rules and service fees) prior to booking. If one doesn't agree with the service fees or rules, one can choose to book elsewhere. I expect people to respect me, my house and my rules whilst on my property. I don't think that is expecting too much and that is the reason we have the rules listed on the site. As far as trespassing goes, it is absolutely unacceptable. See the photo at the top of this post; a private sign should, and has, prevent all guests from feeling free to enter and to use the facilities inside. Thanks for your input.

Ernie
Ernie a year ago
Here is what it states in my house rules: "Any violation of the house rules may result in the immediate termination of the booking agreement. In these instances, all fees will be forfeited and, where appropriate, deductions from the security deposit may be made." This guest can attest to the fact that I enforce the rules.

Deb
Deba year ago
Hi Ernest, this reminds me of the Ben Edelman story. Im guessing you read about it. Here's the link just in case... www.boston.com/food-dining/restaurants(phone number hidden)/harvard-business-school-professor-goes-war-over-worth-chinese-food/KfMaEhab6uUY1COCnTbrXP/story.html

Lula and Larry
Lula and Larrya year ago
The guest had a choice before booking. If she did not like or agreed with the house rules, she should have stayed somewhere else. I think this has more to do with direspecting the Host by ignoring his house rules. I am amazed that somebody will totally disregard and enter a room clearly marked as Private. This person was either totally clueless or felt self entitled and the rules did not apply to her. Not a nice outcome, unfortunately.

Rick
Ricka year ago
Although I can't side with guests who apparently flaunt host rules; I can see that in this case you run a really tight ship, Ernest. Your "story" reads like a court case...it's evident that you have an extensive legal background. You have presented your case point by point---clear & concise....but I hope you realize that most people don't operate in a world where things run like clockwork & where all rules are followed---no bending allowed!

I personally would have balked at the "$25" fee for dropping luggage...you seem shocked that she wanted to negotiate this or perhaps pay it in cash! To me this is so far out of the norm that it bears questioning...But you are correct, of course, in your logic that if someone doesn't like the rules, they can look elsewhere...

Did you really pull the rules of the back of the door & have her read it back to you?? Kind of "school-marmish" & "I told you so", don't you think???!!

Bottom line: It's your house & you have a right to set your own rules & enforce them...but I think it bears pointing out that some things are way outside the standard (email hidden) life so uptight?? Is a crumb in the hallway grounds for eviction??

I'm wondering why, indeed, you ever allowed instant booking!! God knows many guests don 't read rules---yeah, they may acknowledge them---the same way they "accept" the rules when they install a new computer program....do you think they really read them? I say get rid of the instant book feature & run your home the way you want, carefully screening guests so that they fit the profile you desire...

Relax, enjoy yourself, & break a few rules! the world won't stop

Reply Like 5 replies•9 likes Delete
Rebecca
Rebeccaa year ago
In many ways I agree with Rick and Deb. However, the fact that a guest went into an area clearly marked 'Private' is TOTALLY out of order. Never mind if you think the rules are excessive or the fact that guests don't read things before they arrive - to enter a space that is so clearly marked Private is simply inexcusable. It is beyond rude. What kind of person thinks it's ok to do that?? I think, Ernest (Josh?), if you'd just posted that one simple fact you'd have had everybody up in arms! Your rules are very strict, it's true, and for that reason I personally wouldn't book with you despite how great your listings look. Not because I'd have trouble adhering to the rules, just that I prefer a different overall environment. But that's the beauty of Airbnb, isn't it? We have a choice! And it is very clear what you offer - if people are too lazy or stupid to acquaint themselves with that, well it's their look-out. But back to basics, I'll repeat again - entering an area clearly marked Private in someone's home is just outrageous. No excuses whatsoever.

Ernie
Ernie a year ago
Thanks for the support Rebecca. Just curious, what rules, exactly, are so strict? 

Because we've such high turnover with three listings (we've done 515 bookings to be exact in 14 months) these rules have been borne out of experience. We started with our only rule being "Please enjoy your stay in San Francisco!" And because we've had so many guests treat our home like a hotel, we've had to establish these rules to set boundaries not only for our own comfort but more importantly for that of the other guests (all listings share one level of the five story property). 

We used to offer check-ins from 4 to 10pm, with no early or late check-in fees, but found that so many people abused this generous window, sometimes showing up at 2am or as early as 9am, that we eventually changed the check-in parameters. We also added a bag drop-off fee and a after check-out storage fee to discourage people from abusing our goodwill (not to make extra cash, but to place a value on our time and this service). We would often store bags for free and found that as a result we were tethered to the property all day and night such that people could retrieve their belongings. This created much guest fatigue. 

98% of our guests are no trouble and the rules never come up. It is only for those who bend or break multiple rules that something is said to them. Otherwise, it goes in the review and nothing is mentioned in person during their stay. Also, the general demeanor and behavior of the guests when they interact with us sets a tone of how we interact in return. When guests are unassuming, friendly and courteous we are far friendlier and more accommodating, oftentimes driving them to the airport, cooking them dinner, etc.. It kind of works akin to “you give what you get”, or “what comes around goes around.” You get the point.

Rebecca
Rebeccaa year ago
Actually none of your rules are particularly strict. They are all very reasonable and sensible. In hindsight, I was responding to the general tone of the initial post rather than the facts (I'd be a terrible lawyer, wouldn't I). I completely understand how you arrived at the decision to tighten up your check-in/out times etc. Managing 3 listings and ensuring that all guests are happy and comfortable obviously needs careful thought. I know exactly what you mean about guests behaviour setting the tone for how the stay will pan out. I think that element is the one that I've found the most fascinating. There are guests who abide by all the rules but somehow we just fail to make a connection and I don't care how carefully they washed the dishes, I'm not sorry to see them go. On the other hand, as an example, one of my favourite guests ruined a pillow case with her hair dye but we had such fantastic conversations and she inspired my son so it was worth it! I still can't get over the fact that your guest just ignored the 'Private' sign. Only once has a guest come into my private space and that was a genuine emergency. I feel very fortunate that I haven't yet experienced any of the terrible guests that are reported on these groups!

Ernie
Ernie a year ago
Glad to see you feel i'm not such a tyrant. We like to have fun too. Many guests are lifelong friends but some can't leave soon enough.

Deborah
Deboraha year ago
I definitely agree with Ernest and Rebecca that a guest going into a place marked private is totally unacceptable!!

Andrew
Andrewa year ago
I don't personally have any objection to kicking out guests who knowingly and willfully disregard your house rules. Even if the offense is somewhat minor, how can we trust people in our homes knowing that they refuse to respect our boundaries? The kind of guest who would enter private areas without permission is one that I don't trust not to wander into my bedroom or go through my personal stuff...or worse. In Ernest's situation, I would've also asked this guest to leave.

However, I think it's also important that we as hosts take an occasional step back when we experience problems like this, and consider how our own choices might influence their likelihood. In this case, Instant Book is a bleedingly obvious factor. You can learn a lot about a guest from even just a few sentences of communication before a booking, and with IB you effectively forfeit that possibility and accept the risk that you'll get guests who didn't really read your listing or rules, and guests with whom you'll have personality clashes, and worse. Not only does this create more hassle for you as a host, but when you have multiple listings in one house, you potentially create problems for your other guests? Obviously having a rude and disrespectful Airbnber in the bedroom next door is going to impact the experience of one of the 98% of the other guests that's totally fine.

If you're really serious about having guests that understand and accept your policies and your household, the logical thing to do would be to turn off IB and vet your guests more carefully before accepting their reservations. If you're not willing to do that, the complaints of having your goodwill abused and of Airbnb not giving you the "support" to which you feel entitled sound rather disingenuous.

Reply Like 5 replies•1 like Delete
Ernie
Ernie a year ago
I find it alarming that Airbnb has not impressed upon all guests, both those who book through booking requests and those who book through IB, that reading through and respecting the listing and the house rules is required. Shame on Airbnb for that failure.

Ernie
Ernie a year ago
Furthermore, we have found that even those who we have vetted, those who book through the traditional inquiry booking request method oftentimes don't read through the listing/house rules and can be problematic. I believe that this all comes back around to needing more from Airbnb when it comes to guest education before booking. Perhaps a second measure ensuring that a guest is reminded to read and observe the rules before it allows them to book via any method, IB or otherwise. Like: B"efore you proceed with this booking, check here (provide a checkbox for them to complete) to agree to all the terms and conditions as set forth by the host. Realize that any violation of these terms may result in termination of your booking agreement."

Julie and Eric
Julie and Erica year ago
I think Airbnb's main concern is to make booking as easy as possible for the guest, and they've done that by making the REQUEST TO BOOK and INSTANT BOOK buttons huge, minimizing the "contact host" link, and hiding the majority of the text on listing pages. That's the system hosts have to make money, so it's up to us to vet our guests and make sure they read everything we require. Other platforms don't even have profiles for guests.

Julie and Eric
Julie and Erica year ago
This statement exists in the booking for you: "Airbnb now collects and remits government-imposed Occupancy Taxes in this location. By clicking on "Book now", you agree to pay the total amount shown in the summary on the right, which includes Occupancy Taxes and Service Fees, and to follow the Terms of Service, House Rules, Cancellation Policy and Guest Refund Policy."

Andrew
Andrewa year ago
Indeed - that checkbox already is there. The thing is, virtually every internet transaction comes with a checkbox saying you've agreed to terms and conditions. Usually it's such a long list, so full of legalese, that most people probably don't even click through to it. And while it's true that even vetted guests can pose problems, at least you can look at the situation and know that you made a reasonable effort to prevent it. But there's nothing an extra checkbox can do to replace actual communication. Of all the different jobs we could do in the hospitality trade (and I've worked damn near all of them), the system we have on Airbnb gives us the most freedom opportunity to select our clientele of any I have ever seen; if we choose to maximize profits with a fully optional feature that bypasses the selection process, it's well and truly on us when that goes wrong.

Evelyn
Evelyna year ago
It's a pity that many hosts aren't siding with Ernest. We all have rules, it's our home. If a guest doesn't like them they don't have to stay. Period. Do you have your home rules set with the expectation to be broken? You could pay in cash, which also mean open a door marked private and use equipment that isn't included in the listing? Will you do that at a hotel? or another business? Come on hosts, you would be just as upset with this situation. The entitlement of this guest is horrible.

I think it's a great idea a pop up of the house rules before the final booking.

Ernest/Josh - actually held our bags when we were at the Airbnb open, without accepting any compensation. He has a beautiful home and he is an amazing host. I'm sorry you have gone through this.

Reply Like 1 reply•2 likes Delete
Ernie
Ernie a year ago
Thank you Evelyn, I am surprised at the lack of support regarding this issue, but strongly appreciate your comments and sentiments.